Saturday, August 04, 2007

Final (hopefully) Conversation on YearlyKos

And this will conclude my non-coverage of the YearlyKos/Democratic convention. (I know I said I was talking to independents as Shaun Mullen was making cookies and so it was.... I understand the cookies turned out fine, as did the conversations...) The candidate debate was presided over by Matt Bai and some other lesser known folks... So far, carla at Loaded Orygun (now on The Hankster sidebar) wins MVP for the debate section today [people seem to think that Obama was charming... that's nice....]

Someone said this at Group News Blog: "This is really interesting convention, the attendees are very diverse in age, not so much in race, but they do cross income boundaries to some degree...." Well, that's good news....

Marc Ambinder at Atlantic wins the award for Most Improved Player with this comment: "Barack Obama has placed on a pox on both houses of Congress and both political parties...." and "After the forum ended, reporters clustered around Clinton's spokesman, Howard Wolfson...." I don't know, I was talking to independents about Clintonism and how triangualtion hasn't particularly been good for regular people...

On a side note, John Harwood was allowed to say (now that the WSJ has been bought by Rupert Murdoch....) that "Some 53% back the idea of building a third party to mount presidential candidacy...."

The Seminal was really excited because he got a question in on the special session and he's having a party.....

Wait a minute! What's become of me??? I've become THEM! Yikes! I'm blogging about bloggers! Help me!... Oh, that's right... I'm going away to the Newport Folk Festival tomorrow. Thanks!

See you here next week!


jeff roby said...

We've just seen the Democratic dilemma in a nutshell. The Democratic mighty are gathered at the Kos extravaganza, while in
Congress they cave in to Bush on constitutional protections around surveillance. Because Bush threatened to spoil their vacations.

Here, the Democrats can be hammered, hammered, hammered. Cindy Sheehan, running independent against Pelosi, is seen as a prophet.

But to SERIOUSLY press the point, you have the point that their failure is they caved in to Bush. Bush is indeed the devil. However much the Dems opportunistically press the point, Bush is the devil. Bush is the leading edge of fascism in America. To not see that because the Democrats exploit that is in fact just as partisan as any of the politicians you excoriate.

jeff roby said...

On Hullabaloo, Dover Bitch writes:

"The Democrats have seriously alienated a significant portion of their base and they will not replace those voters with the Fox News viewers they sought to appease. It's not easy to win an argument (if it's possible at all) against people who claim there's no difference between the parties. Right now, the results are the same as they were seven months ago.

"The goal, however, has to be to change the composition of the Democratic Party. There is no alternative that has a better chance of success. The only other choice is to give up. Why do that?"

There is an opening here to say why. But not if independents ONLY talk to other independents. If independents are willing to get their hands dirty around an actual issue, they would find that some independents are closer to progressive Democrats than they are to right-wing independents, and some progressive Democrats are closer to progressive independents than they are to the Beltway Bandits who have so far called the tune for the Democratic Party.

Independents are not immunce from identity politics, even if they think the label "independent" (oh, but independents hate labels, sure) is a superior identity.

Nancy, you can pound them into the ground with this!

jeff roby said...

On OpenLeft, Matt Stoller writes:

"We have to get our house in order if we are to restore civil liberties. That means telling the truth about our liberal groups and their complicity in massive strategic and moral errors like this."

And in the comments, MBoz writes:

"When you elect Republican-friendly Democrats to office, you shouldn't be surprised if they start endorsing and supporting Republican policies. Instead of taking potshots at the ACLU (who at least stuck to their principles in this fight), you should keep the focus where it belongs: On the candidates that the netroots put into office to force change, and ended up giving us more of the same."

These are Democrats saying this, and I think they are angrier than independents are.

jeff roby said...

AP reports:

"The [Kansas] Republican Party is forming a loyalty committee so that it can punish officers who endorse or contribute to Democrats."